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Ultimate Debian

You vote how Ultimate Edition should look....


Re: Ultimate Debian

Postby ryanvade » Wed May 22, 2013 11:37 pm

I was kidding with the Arch thing....... ;)
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Re: Ultimate Debian

Postby tanmay.01 » Fri May 24, 2013 2:08 am

XFCE is going to stay with gtk2 atleast for 1 more release cycle.
Mate is good, but resource consumption and the default apps are not that good.
Testing Siduction 13.1 xfce edition...
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Re: Ultimate Debian

Postby Driver » Mon May 27, 2013 2:58 am

tanmay.01 wrote:XFCE is going to stay with gtk2 atleast for 1 more release cycle.
Mate is good, but resource consumption and the default apps are not that good.
Testing Siduction 13.1 xfce edition...


I liked GNOME 2. Liked it so much that I was a bit put out when GNOME 3 happened. I tried MATE on someone's recommendation - they told me that it was a "continuation" of GNOME 2, that it was like it. I guess it was like it, but it sure wasn't IT. The experience of trying it... I suppose if I saw someone across the mall, that kind of looked like my girlfriend, and when I got to her the light was bad so that I did not realize that she wasn't, and I took her into my arms and kissed her, and she slapped my face... I'd probably experience a strange bit of déjà vu now, lol.

Luckily, I then tried Xfce, which doesn't try to look/act like anything except Xfce. IMHO, it seems to be kin in spirit to GNOME 2 - it doesn't ask a lot from your hardware but still manages to deliver a quality, stable desktop environment. And the developers must be old enough to vote, apparently, because it's not full of cheezy crap that does nothing to aid the user, either. It turns out that I actually like it better than GNOME 2.

Siduction... Is that Debian-based? I thought about trying Debian out. I've been using Mint 14 Xfce for a while now, and I really like it and it's got a lot of newer bits in it - or it did, anyway; it's based off Ubuntu Quantal and they've got Raring now, so IDK. But I wanted to keep current on Xfce versions, so I added the 4.10 PPA. Then I found the 4.12 PPA and saw that it had a lot of newer stuff, so I added that one. Then I learned about some newer bits, but I would have to download a tar(?) and figure out how to compile, make, bake, somesuch to add it to my system; and I've tried several times in the past to follow instructions and compile various things, and it never worked, so I want to avoid that. So I thought maybe Debian has the newest bits of Xfce. After all, it's got several versions from stable all the way up through experimental. Considering that Xfce 4.10 is incredibly stable, I figured it would be in "stable" and that the things in the 4.10 and 4.12 PPAs - themselves being completely stable - would either also be in stable or would be in one of the Debian versions that was closer to "stable" than "experimental."

Imagine my surprise when I checked the Debian Wiki's Xfce page and learned that the basic Xfce 4.10 isn't even available except for in "Experimental." Therefore, I'd guess that the newer things that are in the Xfce 4.10 and 4.12 will - eventually - make it to Debian (in "Experimental," lol)... But that I will probably get to experience another birthday or two before it happens. Makes me wonder if the folks at Debian are experimenting with the printing press yet or if they still employ teams of scribes. :roll:

I guess what I'm trying to say is... Wouldn't moving to a Debian base be a big step backward, at least in terms of being able to offer current versions of things (with their current features, which assume the existence of current versions of other things, which assume...)? Or at least a scuttle off to the side, if it means TheeMahn has to do extra work to maintain custom repositories instead of just being able to point toward much of the Ubuntu ones for a lot of components/apps?

Besides, given the law of averages, the folks at Ubuntu are likely to get, well, something right. Any day now. Honest. Err... Maybe :lol: .

I can understand the general frustration level with Ubuntu - I have, after all, tried it a few times, lol. But it probably does save a lot of work and repeated effort to base the distro on it.

I wonder if TheeMahn has ever thought about working with the people that produce Mint? It seems to have a comparable level of refinement (IOW, they also stomp out Ubuntu's forest fires) to Ultimate Edition. I cannot speak for the level of eye candy in it - or lack thereof - because I'm not interested enough in such things to have bothered to check. But in terms of being able to do the job, it's like a deluxe Swiss Army Knife - and in terms of stability, it's about as breakable as your average anvil. And at the same time, it seems to use (some) newer components than Ultimate Edition does if one compares .ISOs that were available and current at the same time. Now I'm going to assume that the Mint folks aren't any smarter than Thee, lol. So their ability to use newer things and still make it all work together... Maybe it's because there might be more people developing Mint than there are developing Ultimate Edition? If that's the case, maybe they would be receptive to the idea of sharing some of the work that both camps have to do with fixing Ubuntu before it makes an adequate core for the respective distros? That would probably be more helpful to TheeMahn than the Mint team, since TheeMahn does most (all? all except for the artwork? I can't remember) of the work on Ultimate Edition himself, IIRC. But I think I read that TheeMahn has written several apps or some tools, if he wished to allow them to use some portion of those in Mint (with proper credit, of course), that could be helpful in balancing the levels of benefit.

Just thinking with my fingers. As always, whatever TheeMahn thinks is best probably really is....
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Re: Ultimate Debian

Postby tanmay.01 » Mon May 27, 2013 10:49 am

Xfce4.10 is available in experimental i guess..!
If i decide to go with debian ... i will build xfce 4.12 on daily basis.
But its just that i am lay to config debian.. so use ubuntu..saves a lot of time..!
I dont think TheeMahn will go with mint ever after Ultimate Edition 3.1 if i am right.
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Re: Ultimate Debian

Postby Xanayoshi » Mon May 27, 2013 12:13 pm

That's not exactly what stable means..if you are going to go for the latest versions it will be almost automatically be labeled "unstable". Stable is proof through testing on multitudes of machines in various scenarios. This is why you see Debian take forever. Mint is no more stable than its Ubuntu or Debian counterpart. It is not Mint XFCE that is being so unproblematic, it is XFCE. You don't find that same reliability so much when you are working with Cinnamon.

I don't think I've ever had XFCE not work for me, but before 4.10 it is just..just..so UGLY.
Personally, I tend to use XFCE and LXDE for my extreme lower end specs, but lately, especially on my Notebook, nothing can touch Bodhi Enlightenment, which I can use on Ubuntu or Debian, but I am using the 12.04 base at present..
bodhi.png



I copied and edited this for later use but haven't gotten to it yet...
This is my starting point for installing XFCE 4.10, but I haven't decided wether or not to use it with say..#! or Siduction. I'm tempted to go back and stay with Gnome 2 paint it Black X-Mas unaltered, but I am trying to stay away from Gnome, because I really hate 3.8.



Sources:
deb http://packages.siduction.org/xfcenext unstable main
deb-src http://packages.siduction.org/xfcenext unstable main


wget http://packages.siduction.org/base/pool ... 29_all.deb

sudo dpkg -i siduction-archive-keyring_2013.03.29_all.deb

rm siduction-archive-keyring_2013.03.29_all.deb

sudo apt-get update

sudo apt-get install xfce4



That's not done yet..I was just getting it ready, I think I need to install many more packages.
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Re: Ultimate Debian

Postby Micro » Mon May 27, 2013 1:11 pm

Just wan't to say a few things:
1. Never heard an Arch user say Ubuntu is fast and stable. :lol:
2. Debian Unstable is more stable than Ubuntu. Period.
3. This pretty much sums up how I feel http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=83321&start=30
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Re: Ultimate Debian

Postby Xanayoshi » Mon May 27, 2013 1:13 pm

Actually, looking at your specs Driver, you might be better off getting on the Debian train before the Ubuntu/Mint train strands you at the station.
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Re: Ultimate Debian

Postby Xanayoshi » Mon May 27, 2013 1:26 pm

Also, I didn't start this thread with cutting Ubuntu ties in mind. I really think Ultimate Edition would benefit greatly from having a low resource Debian release because I can move it to more platforms without having to carry all the Ubuntu garbage with me. Or just have something that could be more beneficial to new users so they could learn how to use Linux, and not whatever seems to be happening with Ubuntu/Mint users. I'm constantly shocked at how I find users of Ubuntu/Mint that have been using these systems for years, don't seem to grasp the basics. So in a way, this is a good thing, because that's what Canonical wants. Still, it's way easier to just install Windows.
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Re: Ultimate Debian

Postby ryanvade » Wed May 29, 2013 9:57 pm

Micro wrote:Just wan't to say a few things:
1. Never heard an Arch user say Ubuntu is fast and stable. :lol:
2. Debiasn Unstable is more stable than Ubuntu. Period.
3. This pretty much sums up how I feel http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=83321&start=30



For a "Complete Experience system" yes. No time spent with customization is NEEDED. Just install and GO. Ubuntu is pretty stable in my book, no issues since 8.04...

Arch is faster then Debian and Ubuntu in terms of Performance. PERIOD. Choose special Kernel, optimize it, only run services that are NEEDED. Much easier to do in Arch. Especially the kernel bit. :ugeek:
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Re: Ultimate Debian

Postby Micro » Thu May 30, 2013 9:12 am

Have you ever used the Debian business card iso. Graphical expert install. It's a targeted install with many options. A custom install if u will and you can choose repos like stable, testing or sid. I like Arch and the stability is good regardless of what people say. Same with Gentoo. And they are true rolling releases. Everyone else is behind the curve.
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